Age of Strategy Forums

Deletes the frustrating chance out of getting a unit converted, and failing to convert a unit. As well as the inability of calculating when you will get your units converted.

Every unit will have at least 100/100 faith. This faith can be altered in map triggers for certain moments where it is necessary to convert the unit, or you want some units to be virtually unconvertable.

My proposed equation is this:

(SP × SR%) = C
C/100 - F/100 = Unit's Current Faith.

If more than one team are competing for a unit the one who gets last hits recieves the unit's "faith"

A friendly units faith bar can be restored like this

(SP ÷ SR%) = C
C/100 + F/100 = Unit's Current Faith

You will not believe but exactly the same thing was in my mind today!
My idea was:
You convert, chance calculated, if miss than a instability added to target unit based on to priest convert probability
On next attempt the converter has extra probabiility because the instability
If again miss than again an instability added to target unit
And so on, gets more and more probanlble to convert.

Also if attempts stop than instability vanishes from target unit with time eg. 3turns.

Nice idea. Could add "propaganda" techs to raise max loyalty.

Good one, but "Propaganda"? Don't they have "Loyalty" tech? "Loyalty" tech already pretty much obsoletes the converting chances though (for damage).

Well, loyalty stabilizes things to ensure your troops don't switch sides on you, just might die out of nowhere. I'd say loyalty could be level 2 of propaganda, making your units hard to convert first, then just almost dying via conflict of loyalty.

I like this idea and support it!! Units having faith and being able to alter that faith at any given time or when you really need to convert a unit, to me, adds a political stand point if I may!! Propaganda research to stabilize your units loyalty, adding more depth to an already extensive experience!! The pen really is mightier than the sword o.o

Opinion: I also think faith should affect healing capabilities now that conversion would be calculatable!! Like say heal cost a certain amount of faith ? Just an idea, not the best but a start

Thanks pussinboots- really awesome idea!! Looking forward to seeing this implemented!!

All newly created units start of with a loyalty meter with 100 loyalty points (100 is maximum point)

Every time unit gets damage loyalty point decreases by 5 (no matter the damage)
Loyalty point cannot b less than 1 wen only gets damage

If enemy healer tries to convert, spell possibility is the amount of loyalty point damaged, if loyalty point becomes 0 or less, unit joins enemy side but starts of with 1 point (so a priest with persuasion has 100% conversion after enemy gets attacked 6 times, but after converting unit is vulnerable to conversion by other enemy healers)

If unit's loyalty point didn't get damaged previous turn it will increase by 10 points on current turn, this is calculated by comparing loyalty point of current turn with previous turn, if it is same it increases by 10, but it cannot increase more than 100

If loyalty point is 1 on current turn it will become 11 next turn regardless the damage from attacks

Spell resistance affects loyalty damage of healers using the same calculations currently used

If loyalty tech is researched, HP of unit decreases instead of changing sides, but loyalty point still becomes 1

Using this system healers can never miss, they simply deal a loyalty damage and convert wen loyalty point is 0

An enemy player or ally player cannot see loyalty meter of Ur unit, only u can see it

Its time to make conversion strategic instead of depending on chance, also it will become easier to convert back Ur unit if it was previously converted by enemy

And war elephants will need to b converted at least twice before it changes side

wow

I think something like this makes sense. I recently played a small map no upgrades water map and sent 4 priests in a wagon and second transport to convert 3 catapults... Didn't convert one and that was the game.... ... ... It would be good if conversion was somewhat more predictable...

That's exactly why I made this post. I want conversion to be more of calculations than chance. Rng for hit chance is enough for me. Nobody wants to use healers or even see them because they are awfully hard to predict.

We could add blue bar for conversion below the green one for health

I was definitely thinking a blue would work great for the conversion bar; would fit in right below the health bar.

viewtopic.php?f=6&t=5068 I made this topic without knowing of its existence can someone merge?

Thanks for finding that. merged and moved here

Yeah, that "New Idea" label slapped there is kinda misleading.

I don't really see people actually discussing this idea.
I think we could use a better equation to calculate conversion.

The way I converted was using the spell resistance so like if it's a 75% spell resistance it would take me like 3 tries. That's how I converted, but when the tech conversion was researched it through my way off, I like this idea a lot!

So to summarise my idea, current spell possibly shall become damage to loyalty points, as puss said loyalty points will b 100 so it takes at least 5 tries for normal healer to convert, and ale's idea of blue bar to represent this metre is also a great idea

Now the point where my idea is different, wen a unit gets atked it will automatically get 5 loyalty damage every time it is atked so u could reduce enemy's loyalty to less than healer's damage and then convert it instantly, or u could healer gang up on the enemy to convert it, 5 healers in the beginning or two healers with persuasion tech can convert it instantly (considering unit has zero spell resistance, if it has some resistance then healer's loyalty damage is reduced by same calculations as used currently) also loyalty points regenerate automatically by 10 points each turn if the unit was neither atked nor any conversion attempt was made on it last turn, the condition for the regeneration is whether or not loyalty point is same as last turn and its less than 100,

if the unit is only atked its loyalty point cannot b less than 1, if it is converted then it joins the enemy team with 1 loyalty point, at this time it is vulnerable to more conversion so u cant just send a newly converted unit to the enemy wen there is an enemy healer on their side, wen loyalty point is 1 it will b the same as last turn since it cannot decrease anymore than 1 so according to the condition it will heal to 11 next turn no matter how many times the unit was atked or converted last turn

I see what you are saying "gok" and I think it can be explained a bit easier like this...

here is the blue bar, (the unit is a sword man) ====== < blue bar (6 points some units could get more that others)
now a healer comes up a tries converting ===== < blue bar (loss of one point now 5)
the player is dumb and dose not kill the healer so another conversion try ==== < blue bar (converted! the sword man now only has 4 conversion points left)

so if the player that originally had the sword man comes with a healer and tries to convert it will be easier because he only has 4 bars of conversion points left
if the unit has no conversion points left it would only take one try to convert. I hope this explains "gok's" idea!
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This doesn't seem like a great idea, unless you like everything to be harder to convert.

No actually easier because you could see your progress.

Just because I could see it, it's not easier, it's probably wasteful thing to do. Unless there's no enemy range units around and the thing you're trying to convert can't get your healer.

I beg to differ.

Well we can try to test it out, to see if people like it.

my idea was, suppose loyalty bar is 20 or less, at that moment healer can deal the '20' damage and convert it instantly, so instead of spell possibility it becomes an atk that deals damage to loyalty of a unit and wen loyalty is 0 the unit shall b converted to enemy side, but after it is converted the loyalty bar is 1, so another enemy healer might now convert it more easily, but if the unit isnt atked his loyalty point increases by 10 each turn until it is hundred again

Every unit would have it's own conversion resistance and conversion points, so I honestly don't see why is this "worse", because healers won't be "O dam I couldn't do it", now they will be "oh well, conversion meter says so". it adds more strategy to the game

Still remember There is still a small chance to be converted at block one in the blue metear idea, but maybe we could change that like Lordofalses was saying..

and my extra suggestion to the strategy is, every unit (except may b workers and transports) shall have a base attack of 5 loyalty damage, this doesnt need to b shown in the stats sheet, so u could try to atk high hp units like elephant to reduce their loyalty and then try to convert, even a unit dealing 1 damage might become more useful than a unit that can one hit kill, because u know that once u have reduced enough loyalty of the enemy unit u can then convert it, as an addition to the strategy i thought may b opponent players wont b able to see the loyalty bar of ur units, only u can, so u know which unit u can trust to send forward and which unit is likely to betray u if u push them too hard

So what's the difference between this new idea and your previous one?

Nothing, its just explanation so that u guys can better understand my idea, and its strategical uses