Age of Strategy Forums

I supose everybody knows about cataphracts. Anyway, i think this should be a new unit. The trouble i find is that cataphracts are from anient age and medieval age too.
Good against infantry, this unit should have this stats:
Cost 5-6
Hp 53
Attack 13-17
Range 1
Armor 3-4/3-5
Spees 4
Sight 7
CR 40%
SR 50%
With trample damage
Bonus against foot meele and ranged units

I dont agree with the trample ability but I dont know what is stronger a full armored knight or a cataphract?

SirPat wrote: ↑Wed Feb 05, 2020 12:37 am I dont agree with the trample ability but I dont know what is stronger a full armored knight or a cataphract?

I don't know if they fought along history. Anyway, i think cataphracts count as a elite unit, then it will be more expensive (more turns) for better quality.
That's why i wrote 6turns at cost.

no I was thinking of who has better armor and equipment so that we can verify the stats of the unit

SirPat wrote: ↑Wed Feb 05, 2020 1:15 am no I was thinking of who has better armor and equipment so that we can verify the stats of the unit

Cataphracts. That is why i set a range for the armor:
Armor 3-4/3-5
They like thanks

about 4/4

SirPat wrote: ↑Wed Feb 05, 2020 2:15 amabout 4/4

What about 5/4
Remembwr he was a shock cavalry. They were made to charge and hold fighting

Agreeable
and Shock Cavalry was used to break formations and scatter enemy infantry

SirPat wrote: ↑Wed Feb 05, 2020 5:54 pm Agreeable
and Shock Cavalry was used to break formations and scatter enemy infantry

He could reduce morale of adjacent enemy units

Just so u know, in this game there r few formations if any, u expose ur shock cavalry, a random halberd riding a wagon will cut off ur head from miles away, and a cavalry cant demoralize simply by standing, make this stronger than centurion but not much stronger than cavalier (as ancient era armor cant compare to middle ages)

Cost 6
Hp 42
Atk 15
Armor 4/3
Speed 5
Spell resist 0%

Affected by blacksmith techs and morale auras

For comparison:
Centurion
Cost 6
Hp 40
Atk 12
Armor 2/3
Has aura

Daimyo
Cost 7
Hp 45
Atk 15
Arnor 3/3
Has aura

Hussar
Cost 5
Hp 35
Atk 12
Armor 0/2
Speed 6

Cavalier
Cost 4 + 12 turn upgrade techs
Hp 45
Atk 14
Armor 3/2

godOfKings wrote: ↑Wed Feb 05, 2020 8:30 pm Just so u know, in this game there r few formations if any, u expose ur shock cavalry, a random halberd riding a wagon will cut off ur head from miles away, and a cavalry cant demoralize simply by standing, make this stronger than centurion but not much stronger than cavalier (as ancient era armor cant compare to middle ages)

Cost 6
Hp 42
Atk 15
Armor 4/3
Speed 5
Spell resist 0%

Affected by blacksmith techs and morale auras

For comparison:
Centurion
Cost 6
Hp 40
Atk 12
Armor 2/3
Has aura

Daimyo
Cost 7
Hp 45
Atk 15
Arnor 3/3
Has aura

Hussar
Cost 5
Hp 35
Atk 12
Armor 0/2
Speed 6

Cavalier
Cost 4 + 12 turn upgrade techs
Hp 45
Atk 14
Armor 3/2

You are right about morale. Then, ¿wich should be the stats? This unit should be produced only on castles, the cavalier in stables, it matters.

A cataphract was a form of armored heavy cavalryman fielded in ancient warfare by a number of peoples in Europe, Eastern Asia, Western Asia, and Northern Africa.
The English word derives from the Greek κατάφρακτος kataphraktos (plural: κατάφρακτοι Kataphraktoi), literally meaning "armored" or "completely enclosed" (the prefix kata-/cata- implying "intense" or "completely"). Historically, the cataphract was a very heavily armored horseman, with both the rider and mount almost completely covered in scale armor, and typically wielding a kontos or lance as his primary weapon.
Cataphracts served as the elite cavalry force for most empires and nations that fielded them, primarily used for charges to break through opposing heavy cavalry and infantry formations.
While they varied in design and appearance, cataphracts were universally the heavy assault force of most nations that deployed them, acting as "shock troops" to deliver the bulk of an offensive manoeuvre, while being supported by various forms of infantry and archers (both mounted and unmounted). While their roles in military history often seem to overlap with lancers or generic heavy cavalry, they should not be considered analogous to these forms of cavalry, and instead represent the separate evolution of a very distinct class of heavy cavalry in the Near East that had certain connotations of prestige, nobility, and esprit de corps attached to them. In many armies, this reflected upon social stratification or a caste system, as only the wealthiest men of noble birth could afford the panoply of the cataphract, not to mention the costs of supporting several war horses and ample amounts of weaponry and armor.
Stats:
Trained at : Stables
Cost: 5
Hp: 30
Att: 8
Spd: 5
Armor: 3/3
Sight: 5
Spell resist :
Bonuses:
75% Mounted
90% Foot melee
140% Siege machines
150% archers
225% Elephants

Surely this should be a weaker version of the knight

I did some googling and what Ive learned was knights and cataphracts are the same but knights have spurs better saddles and stuff making them better at charging at the enemy so yeah

Squirrel5555 wrote: ↑Tue Aug 11, 2020 5:52 pm Surely this should be a weaker version of the knight

it should be a weaker knight plus think about their ancient armor hmm

for 5 turns, and isnce it wasshock cavakry, maybe:
hp 40
attack 11
range 1
armor 3/1
sight 4
speed 4

Shouldn't be 5 turns to begin with.

u r right, then 2/1 armor and less attack

Shouldn't it be just ancient version of shield knight?
So it may be cost 6, with upgraded shield knight stats +2/2 armor and no blacksmith benefits.
To make things a little different, I would change armor bonus this +3/1, so it would end with 7/7.
To fully copy the hoplite/foot knight logic it would also have 100% resistance, but I don't think it fits the unit, unless we added cultural flavour explaining it.

b r u h

I was reading through this topic when this part caught my eye:

QuadrupoleStrat wrote: ↑Tue Aug 11, 2020 2:42 pm only the wealthiest men of noble birth could afford the panoply of the cataphract, not to mention the costs of supporting several war horses and ample amounts of weaponry and armor.

Perhaps if only wealthy people can afford it then it could be a hirable mercenary cavalry, akin to but weaker than a Condotierro.

Panoply
a complete set of arms or suit of armor

so quad didnt meant it in a way like hiring a mercenary but in the way of funding the equipment, food, horses, and salary of a cataphract their armor aren't the most labor-pay efficiency on what I know lamilar and scale mail is really hard to make cause of the lenght of time used on sowing the little plates/scales together.

Endru1241 wrote: ↑Thu Aug 13, 2020 8:11 am Shouldn't it be just ancient version of shield knight?
So it may be cost 6, with upgraded shield knight stats +2/2 armor and no blacksmith benefits.
To make things a little different, I would change armor bonus this +3/1, so it would end with 7/7.
To fully copy the hoplite/foot knight logic it would also have 100% resistance, but I don't think it fits the unit, unless we added cultural flavour explaining it.

isnt it too much? well, i would preffer to make it vulnerable to arrow fire...so maybe less p armor and more hp to compensate it
actually they were from noble families, or at least very rich, so i dont think 100% resistance wouldnt fit, i think its ok
does spartan hoplite still has x3 heal bonus? if it is then this one shouldnt, it owuld be very tanky

We could introduce increased bonusHealing in exchange for p.armor - reflecting hoplite - he would have 1.5 (150% of his medieval counterpart).
It could be then 7/3 armors and 2.0 bonusHealing.

much better! i lke it! how would be the final stats? adn we already have a great sprite

I think he means like this :
Trained at : Stables
Cost: 6
Hp: 29
Att: 8
Spd: 5
Armor: 7/3
Sight: 5
Spell resist :
heal bonus : 2.0
Bonuses:
75% Mounted
90% Foot melee
140% Siege machines
150% archers
225% Elephants

My proposition is:
Cost: 6
Hp: 40
Att: 10
Spd: 4
Armor: 7/3
Sight: 4
Spell resist :
heal bonus : 2.0
resist 100%
Bonuses:
40% vs foot melee, ranged, siege

That's a lot of hp

i would like 50% for bonuses
is there a difference? is just +1 attack against them

QuadrupoleStrat wrote: ↑Fri Aug 14, 2020 12:48 am That's a lot of hp

they were ancient tanks after all

If I am correct 40% is 4+ dmg so he would deal 14dmg to foot melee, ranged, siege.