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Warrior with a small boat.- ANSWERED

Posted: Wed Aug 19, 2020 6:42 pm
by Anchar
Warrior with a small boat.
A warrior who carries in his hands a small boat and an oar instead of a sword and shield is necessary to overcome water surfaces.Has 2 stages: foot and water.More protected from arrows than a simple swordsman because he is protected by a boat as a shield, but has few lives and attacks.
Looks like an ordinary swordsman, but instead of a shield, a boat, and instead of a sword, an oar.
cost: 2-4
We teach in the city center and in the barracks.
Lives: 8-15
Range: 1
Melee armor: 0-1
Long-range armor: ~ 4
Spell resistance is weak.
Speed: 2-3
Attack: 4
The ability to transform into water, makes the fighter vulnerable to arrows.Removes armor completely
Speed: 1-3.
It is necessary to overcome water obstacles in order to more quickly capture urban centers.

Re: Warrior with a small boat.

Posted: Fri Aug 21, 2020 8:34 am
by Anchar
If someone throws me an image of a swordsman, a swordsman with a large shield, a war worth 1 turn, then I can try to draw.

Re: Warrior with a small boat.

Posted: Fri Aug 21, 2020 12:44 pm
by Alexander82
humans have the best transportships in game and making thatboat swordsman would be strange in my opinion

Re: Warrior with a small boat.- ANSWERED

Posted: Fri Aug 21, 2020 1:13 pm
by Anchar
And the orcs have a merlock that costs 1 turn, which accelerates on the water up to 5 tiles per turn, while you train builders, get to the river, build a shipyard there, make a boat in the shipyard, or simply build it, your opponent on the orcs will have time to capture 2/3 of the cards with his own Mermans in 1 turn on the water and Lancers with raptors on land, and this boat will become meaningless.
As for other races: you don't have to write about the undead, lizards have spearmen that walk on water, elves have mermaids, only gnomes with people in the same boat.
And the fleet of people to mine is pretty mediocre.

Re: Warrior with a small boat.- ANSWERED

Posted: Fri Aug 21, 2020 1:15 pm
by Anchar
People definitely need some kind of cheap fighter walking on water.

Re: Warrior with a small boat.- ANSWERED

Posted: Fri Aug 21, 2020 1:24 pm
by Anchar
Instead of boats, you can give wineskins like the Assyrians

Re: Warrior with a small boat.- ANSWERED

Posted: Fri Aug 21, 2020 2:09 pm
by Alexander82
A human can't swim and fight so they rely on boats.

Re: Warrior with a small boat.- ANSWERED

Posted: Fri Aug 21, 2020 2:40 pm
by Anchar
He does not need to be able to fight, his goal is to swim to the city center and capture it like a water one. It is my mistake that I did not add the statistics for the water version, but the water version is reduced to the minimum attack. The Assyrian wars were able to cross the rivers on special water skins, I also remember in the Stronghold 2 game there were wars with small boats specifically for crossing rivers.

Re: Warrior with a small boat.- ANSWERED

Posted: Fri Aug 21, 2020 2:51 pm
by Alexander82
I'm not saying it is impossible but any unit of that kind should be at great disadvantage if fighting with any unit that is able to live in water (e.g. mermen and merlocks, but also skeletons that don't need to breath underwater)

I'd rather later add spells for human casters like "ice bridge" to provide a fast way to cross small water spaces.

I was also planning to add sailors for humans that can enter warships and assault from there (but still from ships to tcs)

also another thing I want to do is to add waterwalk on shallow waters (considering them low enough to cross at reduced speed)

Re: Warrior with a small boat.- ANSWERED

Posted: Fri Aug 21, 2020 3:49 pm
by Anchar
Look: I created a game on the millesland map (100 times) chose people, the enemy of the orcs, I found myself in a snowy valley, he is on the island on the bottom left. I thought victory was assured because water obstacles would slow down the enemy, and I would have time to block him on land, but I was wrong ... He made a merlok in 1 move, which at a speed of 5 in 2-3 moves managed to capture the next island and got ashore into the woods on the left of the map, where did he make whom? Riders on a raptor.
I knew in advance what was going on, the goal was to get to the upper right continent faster, but the river prevented me. I calculated the plan in advance, namely, I made 2 couriers, and sent them to the center that stood 1 tile from the edge of this river, before that a light cavalryman galloped to him. I did it with the help of couriers of an ordinary builder and a builder assistant to build 3 bridge tiles, 2 could be done, but the builder's walking speed was not enough. As a result, the enemy reached on raptors and at the same time led the merman over the water, capturing 4 centers on the continent and completely blocking my further advance, I captured only 1 center, in the future I will capture 1 more center, and he will capture 2 more.Naturally, I cannot knock him out of these centers, because raptors are sitting in them, while I train the spearman, he will already have 4 swordsmen.
The outcome of the battle is lost.

Could some kind of magician worth 6 have time to overtake water merlocks and put up their bridges - the answer is no, a pirate who climbs into the ship would make sense in such a situation - the answer is no.

That's why I propose such ideas.

Re: Warrior with a small boat.- ANSWERED

Posted: Fri Aug 21, 2020 3:59 pm
by Alexander82
Probably early game the water fortifications (that are already in the to-do list) might work better. Anyway it is not that all mages should cost 6 turns.

We can make cheaper units with more specific spell lists (some will be in game soon for elves but we can make something more specific of for humans as well).

Also, btw, is the water on that map shallow water or deep water?

Re: Warrior with a small boat.- ANSWERED

Posted: Fri Aug 21, 2020 7:11 pm
by Anchar
Shallow water

Re: Warrior with a small boat.- ANSWERED

Posted: Fri Aug 21, 2020 7:29 pm
by Alexander82
Then it should be enough to allow land units to wade across shallow waters

Re: Warrior with a small boat.- ANSWERED

Posted: Fri Aug 21, 2020 7:34 pm
by Anchar
and if there is no shallow water? you will have to add a mage worth 1 turn who will put bridges, because this is the only way to compete with mermans that cost 1 turn and speed 5 on the water.

Re: Warrior with a small boat.- ANSWERED

Posted: Fri Aug 21, 2020 8:06 pm
by Alexander82
You either make ships or bridges.

Ships will also gain extra movement speed on deep waters.

Re: Warrior with a small boat.- ANSWERED

Posted: Fri Aug 21, 2020 8:34 pm
by Anchar
Then remove the mermans from the orcs, no boats can compare with the orc mermans, especially with a cost of 1 turn.
I propose to remove the ability for them to capture centers, because these units are unbalanced relative to boats and give a colossal increase to Orcish mobility in water

Re: Warrior with a small boat.- ANSWERED

Posted: Fri Aug 21, 2020 11:31 pm
by Alexander82
Mermen are in the elven army and have a base speed of 6

Merlocks and merblins are in the orcish army and have a base speed of 4 that scales up to 6 with 3 sets of techs (goblin+merlock and orc+merlock).

Both can capture tcs

Neither will be changed nor humans will start waterwalking by using shieldboats.

Re: Warrior with a small boat.- ANSWERED

Posted: Sat Aug 22, 2020 4:36 am
by Anchar
It was the orc water fighters that I had in mind. With a cost of 1 turn and a speed of 4 on water, how can human boats compete with them? Then reduce the speed of making human boats in the building and in the shipyard to 2 turns

Re: Warrior with a small boat.- ANSWERED

Posted: Sat Aug 22, 2020 6:17 am
by Anchar
I do not insist on this particular fighter, but I believe that humans should have an alternative to similar types of fighters from orcs, lizards, undead and elves. If you don't like the particular boat fighter, then I saw a sharkman in the game. If humans have tamed dragons, why shouldn't they have a human shark?
The abilities of magicians are not taken into account for the reason: 1) they take a long time to train and level up 2) Their skills with bridges go as additional ones.

Re: Warrior with a small boat.- ANSWERED

Posted: Sat Aug 22, 2020 7:58 am
by Midonik
Maybe a 2 turn transport boat with one less speed and significantly less hp?

Re: Warrior with a small boat.- ANSWERED

Posted: Sat Aug 22, 2020 8:50 am
by Anchar
Yes, I already suggested in this topic to reduce the cost of the boat, but there is also a minus in that this boat can only be made in the city center next to the water, if you are not lucky, you will have to build a shipyard or the boat itself with the help of builders, which is why you time will play at the pace of capturing city centers relative to the orc from his watter gutter in 1 turn, undead from their pirates worth 2 turns.

Re: Warrior with a small boat.- ANSWERED

Posted: Sat Aug 22, 2020 11:15 am
by Midonik
I'm not suggesting to decrease the cost of the boat but to make a new cheaper one, just to clarify.

Re: Warrior with a small boat.- ANSWERED

Posted: Sat Aug 22, 2020 1:02 pm
by Anchar
Okay, but that doesn't change the essence of my proposal.